Stunts Forum

Stunts - the Game => Custom Cars with Stressed => Topic started by: Krys TOFF on January 05, 2009, 02:41:21 PM

Title: Kart
Post by: Krys TOFF on January 05, 2009, 02:41:21 PM
I just remind that I have a "kart" car made by Ayrton, he sent it to me some time ago now. But car shape is the one of the indy. If someone is interested in/capable of doing a (Mario :D) kart shape, then this car could be completed and added to new cars list.
As for me, I'm already busy enough trying to (finally... ::)) complete my F1 2002 car...
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on February 17, 2009, 10:54:27 PM
I just remind that I have a "kart" car made by Ayrton, he sent it to me some time ago now. But car shape is the one of the indy. If someone is interested in/capable of doing a (Mario :D) kart shape, then this car could be completed and added to new cars list.
As for me, I'm already busy enough trying to (finally... ::)) complete my F1 2002 car...

What kind of kart is it? What specs?

I'm asking this because I've been messing arround with stressed a bit myself, I'm trying to turn the indy into a superkart. It's not Mario, but it's bound to keep looking ridiculous even when it's finished...
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: CTG on February 18, 2009, 01:01:40 AM
LOL!!! ;D
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Chulk on February 18, 2009, 01:53:24 AM
Nice! I sense a new car(t) coming soon...
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Duplode on February 18, 2009, 03:17:42 AM
Heh, very good! ;D
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on February 18, 2009, 09:36:26 AM
By the way, I copied some files of other cars to start testing it. I have a 3d shape STSUKA.P3S, an information file CARSUKA.RES and both an STDASUKA.PVS and STDBSUKA.PVS, and it opens in carblaster now. But since stunts can't open it yet (starts complaining about missing sound, missing shape and a lack of memory somewhere), I've obviously done something wrong. What am I missing?
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Krys TOFF on February 18, 2009, 10:44:09 AM
I just remind that I have a "kart" car made by Ayrton, he sent it to me some time ago now. But car shape is the one of the indy. If someone is interested in/capable of doing a (Mario :D) kart shape, then this car could be completed and added to new cars list.
As for me, I'm already busy enough trying to (finally... ::)) complete my F1 2002 car...

What kind of kart is it? What specs?

I'm asking this because I've been messing arround with stressed a bit myself, I'm trying to turn the indy into a superkart. It's not Mario, but it's bound to keep looking ridiculous even when it's finished...
Don't remember, something like huge acceleration and high braking car but nothing like Lada Niva Comeback. I would have to test it again and I will tell you. I can send you the car files if you want, so far the shape is indy.

Suitable car shape would be something like that :
http://ascon.net/images/edu/kart.jpg (http://ascon.net/images/edu/kart.jpg)
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on February 18, 2009, 11:02:03 AM
I just remind that I have a "kart" car made by Ayrton, he sent it to me some time ago now. But car shape is the one of the indy. If someone is interested in/capable of doing a (Mario :D) kart shape, then this car could be completed and added to new cars list.
As for me, I'm already busy enough trying to (finally... ::)) complete my F1 2002 car...

What kind of kart is it? What specs?

I'm asking this because I've been messing arround with stressed a bit myself, I'm trying to turn the indy into a superkart. It's not Mario, but it's bound to keep looking ridiculous even when it's finished...
Don't remember, something like huge acceleration and high braking car but nothing like Lada Niva Comeback. I would have to test it again and I will tell you. I can send you the car files if you want, so far the shape is indy.

Suitable car shape would be something like that :
http://ascon.net/images/edu/kart.jpg (http://ascon.net/images/edu/kart.jpg)

I'dd like to have a look at your files. I'm aiming at 2.9 seconds to 60mph, a 155mph top and some great cornering. :)

As for the looks, I was more thinking among this kind of lines:
(http://www.brceng.com/images/superkart.gif)
And slowly but steadily things are going the right way...

By the way, it likes to save files in .3sh format, where stunts uses .P3S. Can I just rename these files? Can't be that simple right? Otherwise it would probably work...
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Duplode on February 18, 2009, 07:12:13 PM
By the way, it likes to save files in .3sh format, where stunts uses .P3S. Can I just rename these files? Can't be that simple right? Otherwise it would probably work...

Oops, we forgot to mention that when you told about the missing files. You should keep the extensions as stressed saves them, so that Stunts knows you're using uncompressed data files (the "P" in the original extensions stands for packed - the first thing stressed does when opening a *.P3S is uncompress is to a *.3SH so it can be edited). As long as there is no *.P3S with the same file name in the folder, Stunts will read the *.3SH just as fine. Same thing goes for *.PVS versus *.VSH if you try to edit bitmaps.

Oh, and another thing: be wary when editing custom cars with CarBlaster, as it will re-create the *.P3S and *.PVS files when you save the car if you are using *.3SH and *.VSH. So if after a CarBlaster session your custom shape suddenly vanishes don't worry - just delete the newly created *.P3S. (BTW you can edit cars with missing *.P3S and *.PVS files in CarBlaster: just load an original car and use F9/F10 to scroll to your project).
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on February 18, 2009, 09:41:13 PM
By the way, it likes to save files in .3sh format, where stunts uses .P3S. Can I just rename these files? Can't be that simple right? Otherwise it would probably work...

Oops, we forgot to mention that when you told about the missing files. You should keep the extensions as stressed saves them, so that Stunts knows you're using uncompressed data files (the "P" in the original extensions stands for packed - the first thing stressed does when opening a *.P3S is uncompress is to a *.3SH so it can be edited). As long as there is no *.P3S with the same file name in the folder, Stunts will read the *.3SH just as fine. Same thing goes for *.PVS versus *.VSH if you try to edit bitmaps.

Oh, and another thing: be wary when editing custom cars with CarBlaster, as it will re-create the *.P3S and *.PVS files when you save the car if you are using *.3SH and *.VSH. So if after a CarBlaster session your custom shape suddenly vanishes don't worry - just delete the newly created *.P3S. (BTW you can edit cars with missing *.P3S and *.PVS files in CarBlaster: just load an original car and use F9/F10 to scroll to your project).

Oké, so the PVS and P3S should be kept seperate, got it.
Hé cool. it works. :D
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on April 28, 2009, 01:14:23 PM
I just found another powergear combo: mass 5 drag 14. :) Seems like I'll have to up the drag a little.
Mmh, 15 does the same. Perhaps I'm just making it easy with too big a top gear...
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Duplode on April 28, 2009, 05:00:13 PM
I just found another powergear combo: mass 5 drag 14. :) Seems like I'll have to up the drag a little.
Mmh, 15 does the same. Perhaps I'm just making it easy with too big a top gear...

This just confirms one thing, I think: my explanation in the Car Model Physics is wrong  :) One of many things I need to review there. For the moment, I suggest you to try even-number values for mass, they are (or at least tend to be) less buggy.
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on April 28, 2009, 05:10:44 PM
I just found another powergear combo: mass 5 drag 14. :) Seems like I'll have to up the drag a little.
Mmh, 15 does the same. Perhaps I'm just making it easy with too big a top gear...

This just confirms one thing, I think: my explanation in the Car Model Physics is wrong  :) One of many things I need to review there. For the moment, I suggest you to try even-number values for mass, they are (or at least tend to be) less buggy.
I put the drag to 19 now, and I believe it didn't powergear, but that's quite irrelevant for this specific project from now on, since I gave it a 156 miles/hour topspeed. :)
I'm also in the middle of 3D-model changes and I'm going to attack the dashboard files. The project is actually moving again.
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on April 28, 2009, 09:41:02 PM
Oké, let's see how much you all know about this stuff.
I've been editing STDA and STDB, and now the car doesn't work anymore. I haven't edited .res since it worked, just added new versions of STDA and STDB. I have deleted some of the bitmaps in STDA, but not all cars use all of these anyway, so I thought it wouldn't matter. I don't think it's a problem with the use of colors, because it affects some of the black-transparant masks too. When I reopen the files in stressed (even if I haven't opened stunts in the mean time) some of the pictures are warped, malformed. It could be some kind of miscoördination between the onjects and car.res's idea about where to place them, but the size of the objects hasn't changed too much actually. The bitmaps unaffected are the 3 parts of the dashboard, the 3 parts of the dot and the alternate pallets, which I did not alter. The bitmaps I erased are roof, ins1, ins3, inm1 and inm3, I didn't need those. Something is going wrong here, but why? I'm hoping one of you encountered this before, otherwise I'll have to start researching for myself... [/lazy]
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Duplode on April 28, 2009, 10:18:07 PM
These are two distinct issues. I remember running into the issue of warped bitmaps before when editing gearbox graphics for the GT3 (they look like if the vertical axis of the image was rotated sideways, isn't it?). I can't recall exactly what happened but if I remember correctly it was something about image dimensions (try making the affected bitmaps one pixel wider (or narrower, or shorter, or taller) so they have an even total number of pixels). As for the failure to load the car, it happened because you can't delete ins1 and ins3, as they are always loaded when the steering wheel is turned (inm1 and inm3 might not be obligatory, but chances are you'll need them for the design). You'll probably change your mind about deleting them anyway, as they make the steering wheel motion look quite a lot better when properly set (unless your kart has no meters which are covered by the steering wheel, of course).
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on April 28, 2009, 10:38:03 PM
These are two distinct issues. I remember running into the issue of warped bitmaps before when editing gearbox graphics for the GT3 (they look like if the vertical axis of the image was rotated sideways, isn't it?). I can't recall exactly what happened but if I remember correctly it was something about image dimensions (try making the affected bitmaps one pixel wider (or narrower, or shorter, or taller) so they have an even total number of pixels). As for the failure to load the car, it happened because you can't delete ins1 and ins3, as they are always loaded when the steering wheel is turned (inm1 and inm3 might not be obligatory, but chances are you'll need them for the design). You'll probably change your mind about deleting them anyway, as they make the steering wheel motion look quite a lot better when properly set (unless your kart has no meters which are covered by the steering wheel, of course).
Thanks. I'll try that. Seems like that'll take care of my issues.
Also I remembered: I may not have altered the dimensions too much, but I started from the Jag interior, while my new .res is Indy based... ::)
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Duplode on April 28, 2009, 10:54:50 PM
I don't think you need to be worried about the .res in this case, as it only controls the position of moving parts, and not the actual dimensions or other image properties. Just ensure your bitmaps do not have odd numbers for both width and height.
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on April 28, 2009, 11:10:44 PM
Mmh, I have all ins and ims files again, and all my bitmaps now have even dimensions (indeed, all of the misbehaving ones had at least one uneven dimension), but both my problems remain... Guess the criteria are a bit sharper then just being even. On top of that, some of the original bitmaps actually do have uneven dimensions. Strange...

I'll see if I can get some serious investigating done tomorrow...
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Duplode on April 28, 2009, 11:24:04 PM
Weird... looking at the STDA I did for the GT3, none of the bitmaps have width and length simultaneously odd, even if the gearbox base is 64x45. There are only two things I can think of right now: the order of the resources in the file and the unknown parameters of the bitmaps (displayed below the coordinates and dimensions - try copying them from the Jaguar and see if it makes some difference).
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on April 30, 2009, 12:41:35 AM
Okay, what I've found so far is that the mistery bites are most likely the problem/one of the problems. They are at least partially size related. I know that because in most cars bitmaps that belong together like whl1, 2 and 3 have the same mystery bites. In the ferrari however whl 1 has a different size than the other two, and slightly different mistery bites. There does not seem to be a logical connection though. The speedgate used all the sizes, positions and mistery bites from the porsche imsa, so that trick should work for me too. However, the roof bitmaps are the same size for many cars, but have different mistery bites. So the next question I'm gonna answer is: can parts of different cars be combined without a problem? And next up: can the x-y position of a bitmap be changed without changing the mistery bites? And finally: do the same mistery bites work on a bitmap with the same size and position but a different name than the original? (In other words: can I make a gearbox the size of my dashboard or maybe just hang it down the roof?)

More information will follow.

EDIT: The mistery bites are dependent on more than size and location. I tried transplanting the mistery bites from the roof of the 962 to the audi, having the same size and location. It did not appear to be warped upon reopening, but stunts didn't accept it. What's more, stunts didn't accept it when I changed the mistery bites back. I then replaced the test file by the original I had saved elsewhere, and windows said the file I was replacing was much larger than the one I was pasting. It did work again after that, but apparently those little bites control something behind the scenes bigger then themselves. Master-bites, I hate them already. So, the interior will have to be based on one car.

Then I tried to change the position of the gearbox of the audi a bit, with the same result. No warping, but no startup either and a much bigger file.

And exactly the same results for trying to make a gearbox with the picture, coördinates and bites of the roof.

So now it was time for the final test: saving the file without making any changes at all. Guess what? Same problem. The filesize hadn't changed this time, but stunts did not accept the file. What am I doing wrong here?
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on April 30, 2009, 01:35:27 PM
O, wait, I should save as VSH, the compression issue again.

Well, that solved most of my issues, now even my own set of pictures works, it's just still warped, even when driving it. :) I'll start reïnvestigating...

EDIT: this time around everything worked. I can replace the mistery bites of the audi roof by the 962 ones, I can move the gearbox and I can replave the gearbox graphic's and bites completely by the ones from the roof, with the knod half in and out of the picture. However, that last operation resulted in one of the palettes showing up at the top of my screen, but only when the normal non-gearbox roof was showing.

Mmh, now my gnab refuses to be transparent, plus both my gnob and gnab automatically chance one of their mistery values from 14 to 04 when I load the picture...
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Duplode on April 30, 2009, 04:10:25 PM
Nice that things are (more or less) working now  :) For future reference, at which step exactly of the tests did the warping problem disappeared?

About the unknown value changing by itself: I guess we (for the moment) do not need to worry about it. Looking at Stressed source code shows that Dstien made it so the values are automatically set to 01, 02, 04 and 08 on importing a pic (probably because he didn't know exactly what to do with the values either  :)). As for the non-transparent gnab, probably you can solve it by opening it on Photoshop/GIMP/etc. and using the "Color to Alpha" option to make the "background" transparent before importing it back (the alpha mask information is lost when exporting a picture).
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on April 30, 2009, 04:57:14 PM
Nice that things are (more or less) working now  :) For future reference, at which step exactly of the tests did the warping problem disappeared?

About the unknown value changing by itself: I guess we (for the moment) do not need to worry about it. Looking at Stressed source code shows that Dstien made it so the values are automatically set to 01, 02, 04 and 08 on importing a pic (probably because he didn't know exactly what to do with the values either  :)). As for the non-transparent gnab, probably you can solve it by opening it on Photoshop/GIMP/etc. and using the "Color to Alpha" option to make the "background" transparent before importing it back (the alpha mask information is lost when exporting a picture).

I actually had a transparent version, but I wanted to make it bigger (as big as the knob of another car) so that I'dd know which mistery bites to enter in order to prevent it from warping. That part worked, it doesn't warp anymore. Now I can't get the larger picture to be transparent in stressed, it has a green background. I never used green in that image. I tried saving it with all sorts of different setting in the GIMP, but it stays green, and doesn't become transparent in stunts either. I have a similar problem with the upper end of the dashboard, the transparent area becomes white. Oké, it is white, but the mask should make it transparent. Although now I think about it, it should probably be black, that might work...

Cool, it did work. So it's just the knob then that disbehaves for now.

EDIT: I just noticed I managed to save the gnab as an indexed picture. I quickly fixed it to RGB, it works too now. I need to start messing less things up...
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Duplode on April 30, 2009, 05:25:46 PM
EDIT: I just noticed I managed to save the gnab as an indexed picture. I quickly fixed it to RGB, it works too now. I need to start messing less things up...

It worked as RGB but not as indexed? Cool, it seems I had been underestimating the power of stressed all along... (so far, I thought you had to save the bitmap as indexed and import the exact Stunts palette into GIMP for it to work, but in fact it can convert from RGB correctly)
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on May 01, 2009, 12:07:20 PM
Did you know that there is a minimum dashboard height? I tried making dast and dasm as big as dash, to create an "open" car, but it seems the dashboard must be at least something like 35 pixels high, the screen just ends in a whole lot of colorfull pictures below there. :) In fact, it appears to be loading a random image from the game itself, I just saw the curtains from the car selection screen.

EDIT: And now I made my kart too big. Stunts can't reserve enough memory... :(
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on May 04, 2009, 04:48:53 PM
Oké, after having about a week of vacation, I am proud to release the superkart, version 0.0 beta.

Why beta?
This version still has some problems, mainly dashboard problems, I know why this is, I just don't know how to fix it. They mainly surface when using the replay menu or when driving outside the standard in-car view. This is a big issue, and I should probably fix it by replacing my ugly drawings with an only slightly modified version of the Indy dashboard. Untill then I'dd like other people's input on any other issues they run into. This being a beta does not mean you should wait for the real thing, I would really like to hear all your cowboy stories about bugs you encountered.

Visual
Thanks to Crashper I now have a driver that can actually be modelled, which means I could go for an open look like these karts have in reality, instead of a closed car looking like a shortened Indy. While Crashper is in the vehicle when you look at it from the outside, he's just there to help. As soon as you get in yourself you'll see there are no hands on the wheel, let alone his hands. The dashboard is about as ugly as expected by me and has actual steering wheels, a stunts first I believe. Also, the car is always green while you're in it. But as mentioned, the dashboard has it's problems, enjoy it while it lasts. The view hight is set a lot lower than Crashper's head actually is, but it looks better this way.
(http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/7939/sukashowt.jpg)

Unda tha hood
The Flat road top speed is 153mph, bumps bring the top up to 156 seconds, the 2.9 seconds to 60mph I put in the official data sheet is actually pretty accurate. The programmed wheelbase is only as wide as the real wheelbase, but as long as the entire car, give it a shorter wheelbase and it'll go down in a blaze of bugs. The small width gives the car an edge at driving through the middle of slalom blocks and jumping through loops, making this a bit of a cheat car, but the low top speed gives it a disadvantage at driving straight through objects. When coming up to a traffic light you should not park next to an Indy or Speedgate, but you can stay ahead of the 962 for about 17 seconds, and ahead of the Jag for even a few seconds more. Cornering is done at speeds exeeding 120 mph. The feel of the car might be a bit strange in the beginning, and you might have to watch out for a big fat magic carpet every now and then, but it really handles quite good. With six gears and high acceleration it's not the ideal car to learn driving manual in though. In automatic however it's a good newbie vehicle, with a limited top speed and jump length helping not to run into nasty surprises, like bouncing of a banked corner just behind a jumping bridge. They also make some of the more extreme stunts impossible though, and really fast tracks become a bit boring (I managed to get an avarage speed of 149mph more then ones, just 4 below the flat rood top speed). The superkart does not come with a powergear on top of its 6 normal ones.

Aren't you forgetting something?
Yes, I am, I would like to give a big thanks to Dstien for Stressed, thank Mark Nailwood for Carblaster and thank everyone who ever contributed to the dissection of the stunts files, especially Duplode for his recent revelations on car size.

So, shall I go break your record for smallest car now?
You're free to do so, but I'dd advice against it. From what I've seen so far this is about as small as you should want a stunts car to be, make it smaller and you'll enter a bugfest. So I'm affraid we'll never get to ride a remote controlled vehicle in stunts. (what? That's meta-simulating, it would be cool.)

Anyway, enjoy.
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Chulk on May 04, 2009, 05:17:10 PM
Great! I'll test it tonight and you'll get feedback tomorrow...
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Duplode on May 05, 2009, 05:54:19 PM
 8)!!

I tested your kart a bit. I didn't do much actual driving, but on first impression the kart feel is really nice and convincing, and the solutions on the dashboard are smart. And Casper on sunglasses makes a good logo for your team too, I guess  :)

But right now the pressing issue is probably the dashboard malfunctions... After comparing the dash/dasm/dast of Indy and the IMSA cars, I noticed the second unknown value is related to the vertical size of the bitmaps. For instance, unk2 of Indy's dash is FFA0h = -96. dasm and dast are 8 pixel-high bitmaps, and unk2 for them is FFA8h =  -88 - exactly eight more than for dash. Doing the analogous modification on unk2 in STDASUKA.vsh dasm/dast (that is, making it equal to 62+dash's unk2) appears to solve the most serious problem (screen corruption + eventual crash after pausing the game or switching cameras). The modified file is attached. The other two issues are comparatively minor:slightly flickering meter needles and dot, dast staying on foreground above the replay bar buttons (this hopefully can be solved by studying a bit more the unknown values) and some small graphical artifacts around the upper part of the steering wheel (if no better solution can be found, I guess this can be workaround'ed by changing the shape of dast slightly so it becomes convex).

Edit: Oh well, it seems that change didn't really solve the issue, just (maybe) made it took longer to appear...

Edit 2: I exchanged the file for another with more alterations of the same kind - and now it does seem better - it didn't crash after ~4 minutes of constant pausing and rewinding. I also messed up a bit with inm/ins, maybe some of it (such as exchanging the files) wasn't really needed and made the needle display slightly more buggy when you turn the steering.

Edit 3: About the dashboard vs. replay bar issue, it seems Stunts will always render dasm/dast on the top of the replay bar. That is not an issue for Indy/P962/Jaguar because their 'dash's are taller than the replay bar (>49 pixels). Thus, there is not much to be done other than making the dashboard 11 pixels taller/higher (that will hurt the Kart feeling quite a bit, so you'll likely prefer to live with the bug...).
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: BonzaiJoe on May 05, 2009, 06:40:06 PM
Congratulations Overdrijf!

The Kart feels just like a kart and has a very innovative design, and you are one of the funniest people in the Stunts world :)
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on May 06, 2009, 11:23:20 AM
Thanks for the feedback guys. Glad to see you like it. Wow, the dashboard does appear to work now. I thought it might have to do with dash being larger than seen on screen (I made dash this big because I didn't know the mistery bites for a smaller version), but apparently not. Thanks.
I knew some issues were related to dast/dasm. It's rendered above any steering elements for instance, which is why I didn't use ins1 and 3 to make a turning steering wheel. This is also what hinders the meters and dot (dot being a bit off center is a different issue alltogether, I'll fix that soon, just somehow missed it). But above the replay menu, what were those programmers thinking? :)
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Duplode on May 06, 2009, 05:03:56 PM
Reducing dash/dasm/dast/whl1/whl2/whl3 vertically would, however, make the file quite a bit smaller, now that we (kind of) know how to set mystery bytes. BTW, there is another catch: ins(m)1/3 coordinates are relative to ins2 - they do not appear at all on your original dashboard because Y=147+166 is well below the screen. Setting their Y to zero on your original file causes them to interfere with ins2 and trigger the graphical corruption instantly when the game is paused. That should be accounted when restoring your original inm/ins and setting the definitive unknown values.

Another speculation: I wonder if dasm might act on dash as well as dast - probably not, but worth trying maybe...
Title: Re: Kart
Post by: Overdrijf on May 06, 2009, 05:39:52 PM
Another speculation: I wonder if dasm might act on dash as well as dast - probably not, but worth trying maybe...
Nope, tried that. dast goes over dash, but dash is visible where dast/dasm is transparent.

I'll try the resizing and setting the bites, but first I have some real work to do. I really hope I can concentrate mostly on college for a few days without stunts calling me all the time. ;)