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Posted by Friker
- December 17, 2014, 12:40:00 PMQuote from: CTG on November 10, 2014, 09:54:45 AM
...BUT! What if you take only short, tricky sections to create magic carpets, extreme jumps or simply a perfect 90 degree corner? Usually it's only a 0.5-2 seconds long section and gear switches are quite limited in a certain part of the track (---> less combinations). The buffer parts, such as straight roads do not really require this kind of method - only a few critical sections need that kind of maxout. It would not create a perfect replay, only a perfect trick or corner. ...
This is a way I was thinking about. But you will need a measure which can compare which replay is better than others. And that is quite hard with magic carpets.. Perfectly cut corners/loops could be possible.
Posted by CTG
- November 10, 2014, 09:54:45 AMThe theoretical possibility of creating such a software is a fact. However, the calculation time for a whole replay would be fuckin' long. BUT! What if you take only short, tricky sections to create magic carpets, extreme jumps or simply a perfect 90 degree corner? Usually it's only a 0.5-2 seconds long section and gear switches are quite limited in a certain part of the track (---> less combinations). The buffer parts, such as straight roads do not really require this kind of method - only a few critical sections need that kind of maxout. It would not create a perfect replay, only a perfect trick or corner.
What do we know?
- You know each cars behaviour from .RES files (torque, weight, air drag, etc.).
- You can reproduce your replays in Excel (by knowing the surface parameters) - if you modify some keypress codes in the file, it can regenerate your position on the map. Optimizing requires advanced programming skills.
- You can easily visualize replays, just think on stuntschallenge.
The above mentioned stuff is enough for that - we have some addicts, being able to create something like that. As for me, the software exists. But I don't really care anymore.
What do we know?
- You know each cars behaviour from .RES files (torque, weight, air drag, etc.).
- You can reproduce your replays in Excel (by knowing the surface parameters) - if you modify some keypress codes in the file, it can regenerate your position on the map. Optimizing requires advanced programming skills.
- You can easily visualize replays, just think on stuntschallenge.
The above mentioned stuff is enough for that - we have some addicts, being able to create something like that. As for me, the software exists. But I don't really care anymore.
Posted by CTG
- December 15, 2012, 10:18:04 AMQuote from: Friker on December 06, 2012, 02:25:28 AMQuote from: BonzaiJoe on December 06, 2012, 02:12:44 AM
How about just simulating all possible keypress sequences and detecting the fastest finished one?
A track of ~1 minute has about 1200 'moments', and about 64 possible keypress combinations for each moment, so that leaves only about 64^1200 possible replays, . So if you pre-set a max-time that you know the perfect replay should be within, you can just run all the simulations, and the perfect replay should be ready an infinite length of time after the end of the universe.Quote from: CTG on February 03, 2005, 03:01:25 AM
Once I asked Zak about the possibilty of a program counting the best available replay. He said no - but what if we have the source code? Is there a program being able to produce the perfect replay? Just think it over:
Average length: 80 seconds (1600 units)
3 different buttons can be used in the same time unit (42 combinations)
Possible keyboard combinations in one unit with real meaning: about 20
The program must count 20^1600 possibilities...
When we are already ensured that a perfect replay is impossible we could start about near-perfect replays. That is what I've done.
Btw player could strike at most 3 keys at a moment but I think all 6 keys could be simulated at once.
Why do I feel that Friker owns that program?
Posted by BonzaiJoe
- December 06, 2012, 12:30:32 PM"but in a nihilist's world there is no "best". there is only staying home on a cloudy day and lying still on the couch at awkward angles. in slow motion."
Posted by BonzaiJoe
- December 06, 2012, 12:24:18 PMQuote from: Duplode on December 06, 2012, 04:46:50 AMQuote from: Friker on December 06, 2012, 01:34:32 AM
the same but with heuristics? hmm.. these should be really good heuristics to complete a run within a month.
some machine learning? i can imagine to train some situations and then apply it. still it would discard some of the best tricks. but really usable with OWOOT rules! the note: that training has to be huge because of many entrance speeds and many track's pieces combinations to learn.
ok so with the whole engine we could have a machine that makes nearly perfect replays with owoot rules. as long as it does not making money it's good only for ruin a game and probably master thesis.
It boils down to designing a smarter Skid, then. In fact, there is actually some prior art related to that specific issue, though it isn't down the computer science alley...
One of the best events in Stunts culture
Posted by dstien
- December 06, 2012, 10:17:54 AMSome of the ideas I've had with restunts involves automated replay analysis, which, in addition to aid completely automated competition verification, also could help develop perfect AI using genetic algorithms. Unfortunately, none of us have had time to work on restunts in years. 
Posted by Duplode
- December 06, 2012, 04:46:50 AMQuote from: Friker on December 06, 2012, 01:34:32 AM
the same but with heuristics? hmm.. these should be really good heuristics to complete a run within a month.
some machine learning? i can imagine to train some situations and then apply it. still it would discard some of the best tricks. but really usable with OWOOT rules! the note: that training has to be huge because of many entrance speeds and many track's pieces combinations to learn.
ok so with the whole engine we could have a machine that makes nearly perfect replays with owoot rules. as long as it does not making money it's good only for ruin a game and probably master thesis.
It boils down to designing a smarter Skid, then. In fact, there is actually some prior art related to that specific issue, though it isn't down the computer science alley...
Posted by CTG
- December 06, 2012, 02:26:43 AMLOL, our messages were sent in the same second. 
Posted by Friker
- December 06, 2012, 02:25:28 AMQuote from: BonzaiJoe on December 06, 2012, 02:12:44 AM
How about just simulating all possible keypress sequences and detecting the fastest finished one?
A track of ~1 minute has about 1200 'moments', and about 64 possible keypress combinations for each moment, so that leaves only about 64^1200 possible replays, . So if you pre-set a max-time that you know the perfect replay should be within, you can just run all the simulations, and the perfect replay should be ready an infinite length of time after the end of the universe.
Quote from: CTG on February 03, 2005, 03:01:25 AM
Once I asked Zak about the possibilty of a program counting the best available replay. He said no - but what if we have the source code? Is there a program being able to produce the perfect replay? Just think it over:
Average length: 80 seconds (1600 units)
3 different buttons can be used in the same time unit (42 combinations)
Possible keyboard combinations in one unit with real meaning: about 20
The program must count 20^1600 possibilities...
When we are already ensured that a perfect replay is impossible we could start about near-perfect replays. That is what I've done.
Btw player could strike at most 3 keys at a moment but I think all 6 keys could be simulated at once.
Posted by CTG
- December 06, 2012, 02:25:28 AMQuote from: BonzaiJoe on December 06, 2012, 02:12:44 AM
How about just simulating all possible keypress sequences and detecting the fastest finished one?
A track of ~1 minute has about 1200 'moments', and about 64 possible keypress combinations for each moment, so that leaves only about 64^1200 possible replays, . So if you pre-set a max-time that you know the perfect replay should be within, you can just run all the simulations, and the perfect replay should be ready an infinite length of time after the end of the universe.
Could be simplified a bit: ~20 combinations make sense, usually you press the accelerator and follow the road.
(Even molecule structures can be calculated with a computer - an old DOS game should not mean any problems)
Posted by BonzaiJoe
- December 06, 2012, 02:12:44 AMHow about just simulating all possible keypress sequences and detecting the fastest finished one?
A track of ~1 minute has about 1200 'moments', and about 64 possible keypress combinations for each moment, so that leaves only about 64^1200 possible replays, . So if you pre-set a max-time that you know the perfect replay should be within, you can just run all the simulations, and the perfect replay should be ready an infinite length of time after the end of the universe.
A track of ~1 minute has about 1200 'moments', and about 64 possible keypress combinations for each moment, so that leaves only about 64^1200 possible replays, . So if you pre-set a max-time that you know the perfect replay should be within, you can just run all the simulations, and the perfect replay should be ready an infinite length of time after the end of the universe.
Posted by Friker
- December 06, 2012, 01:34:32 AMQuote from: HappyWorm on May 08, 2005, 11:40:50 AMQuote from: zaqracksince when you are watching a replay, Stunts regenerates the whole physic happenings, collisions, acceleration, jumps, etc, everything, it's impossible to do a separate RPL viewer/editor without the sources of the original stunts physic engine.
if we'd have the sources it'd be not that hard to code an optimized replay searcher/writer, so let's celebrate we dont have the sources.
well you have at least the possibility to write a wrapper that hooks into the replay-engine when stunts is loaded to memory and directly passes commands at the engine and fetches the result. of course this would be not very nice but I think it'll work.
second thing would be to reverse-engineer the whole program, first use a decompiler (if I remember correctly stunts was written in Microsoft C 5) and then translate the remaining asm-code per hand - time-consuming but a chance to get the code
ok, you have the code. so what to do now?
replay editor? hex editor is good enough (and still do not make good results)
some tester of bruteforce replays? ha ha
the same but with heuristics? hmm.. these should be really good heuristics to complete a run within a month.
some machine learning? i can imagine to train some situations and then apply it. still it would discard some of the best tricks. but really usable with OWOOT rules! the note: that training has to be huge because of many entrance speeds and many track's pieces combinations to learn.
ok so with the whole engine we could have a machine that makes nearly perfect replays with owoot rules. as long as it does not making money it's good only for ruin a game and probably master thesis.
thinking again about the tester with heuristic.. probably, but I don't have any clue.
Posted by CTG
- December 06, 2012, 01:20:55 AMHahaha, Friker made it.
Posted by CTG
- November 27, 2007, 10:31:48 PMQuote from: Chulk on November 27, 2007, 08:45:30 PM
One thing we know for sure... You created the perfect spamm editor!
False. I AM the perfect spam editor.
Posted by Chulk
- November 27, 2007, 08:45:30 PMOne thing we know for sure... You created the perfect spamm editor!