Useless messages - place for maniacs!

[Chulk]

There is no worst thing that somebody hates his own country.

Of course there is. Your country is only the piece of land under your feet when you were born. You can love and hate things related to it at the same time. Blind patriotism is just stupid.
Rapers, muerderers, corrupted politics, thieves. All of those are worse than somebody just "hating" their own country.
CTG hates his country, yet he does no harm to people.
American soldiers love their country, and they show this by killing people in other to take their oil.

Who is worst of this two?

[alanrotoi]

Well it's a matter of lenguage, when I say "country" I mean not only my land, the own culture and people too. You don't have a country only with land.

[BonzaiJoe]

What about North Korean people who hate their own country?
Do you "hate" any countries? Are people from those countries also stupid if they agree with you?
I hope you don't hate any countries 

If someone hates a whole people, that's racist, no matter if it's his own people or another. I don't think CTG hates Hungarian people in general.

I get pretty tired of Danish culture and mentality sometimes. Maybe it's because I come so close to it, so I can see the bad sides clearly...

[alanrotoi]

How do you know in N Korea some people hate their country? I guess if there is hate would be against their government, not against the country and culture.

[Chulk]

How do you know in N Korea some people hate their country? I guess if there is hate would be against their government, not against the country and culture.

I hate some things about my country. The government and politicians in general for a start. And that part of "Argentinian culture" according to which it is best to be "piola/vivo/pillo" and take advantage in unethical ways. I hate that about Argentina and it's culture.

[alanrotoi]

So in other countries there aren't politicians "vivos/pillos/piolas". Come on, that it's not culture, it's inherent of human race to take advantage to others. We are animals after all.

[BonzaiJoe]

How do you know in N Korea some people hate their country? I guess if there is hate would be against their government, not against the country and culture.

I can't know that. Actually, Iran is a better example. After the 1979 revolution, not only the political situation, but the whole culture in the country has changed. Traditions have been uprooted and new, religious ones introduced. How do you think the Iranians who loved the old, Persian culture feel about their country now? They might consider what they loved "Iranian", but the next generation will think of the same culture as "un-Iranian" because it is so much in contrast to the current islamic culture.

Anyway, I'm not a fan of hate in general, so I agree no one should hate his own country.

[Chulk]

So in other countries there aren't politicians "vivos/pillos/piolas". Come on, that it's not culture, it's inherent of human race to take advantage to others. We are animals after all.

You mixed my complaint about politicians and "vivos/pillos/piolas", but they were two separate things. The problem here is that people think they are "mas vivos" for stealing some candies, illegal getting cable TV, and such stupid things. People do it around the world, everywhere. But it's the Argentinian people that things this is not a felony but instead is just being smarter than the rest. That's what I hate.

[alanrotoi]

So in other countries there aren't politicians "vivos/pillos/piolas". Come on, that it's not culture, it's inherent of human race to take advantage to others. We are animals after all.

You mixed my complaint about politicians and "vivos/pillos/piolas", but they were two separate things. The problem here is that people think they are "mas vivos" for stealing some candies, illegal getting cable TV, and such stupid things. People do it around the world, everywhere. But it's the Argentinian people that things this is not a felony but instead is just being smarter than the rest. That's what I hate.

You MUST know that's not an argentinian thing only. There is a speech about how latin americans are so stupid, bad and uncultured. And Europeans are so good, so fine, so cultured, so sober, so white... With arguments said by argentinians like "Argentinians are the worst shit", "our politicians are the worst", etc. But when they speak about USA or Europe they say that's the best people of the world, the best economy, best culture, best blablabla. STOP IT! It's not true! Stop being an anti-argentina you MUST fight for your things. Do you think that "we are the worst shit in the world or almost" is something that fit with us? Do you think there aren't stupid "pillos" in other countries, such other from latin america or USA or Europe or Africa?

You MUST know bad people are everywhere, bad politicians bad lawyers, bad taylors.... You may hate CFK a lot, but she is not the whole country. To be an "anti" is to be nothing and it makes worse if you are an anti your own people! I strongly suggest you to reconsider if we are all a stallin shit or almost or not.

The same with the south american region, some argentinians feels "more european" (as if it would be better) than the others, not only for the skin color or blood, because their money haha. I think our last crisis, if it had a good thing, was to put us again in our place in the map, SOUTH AMERICA!

I insist, the speech "we are the shit" is long time known. Don't play that game.

[Chulk]

"Argentinians are the worst shit"

Did I ever said that?

Stop being an anti-argentina

I'm not anti-argentina. I love my country but there are things I hate about it. I'll say it in Spanish, because English is not clear enough about it.

Se que hay ladrones y tranfugas en todos lados, pero el aplaudir al que se cuelga del cable o al que le encuentra la vuelta al sistema es tipico de argento.
En el mundo entero se hace, pero aca se festeja como una piolada. Eso es lo que me molesta y mucho.
Anda a decirle a un japones que das vuelta el medidor de gas para que te llegue menos a fin de mes y fijate cuantos te aplauden. Aca la mayoria te aplaude, porque se creen todos vivos.
Eso nada mas, no digo que somos la peor mierda ni muchisimo menos. Pero lo que el argentino mismo define como "argentineadas" (esas cositas por fuera del sistema, con el unico fin de creerse mas vivo y piola que el resto) las odio.

[alanrotoi]

Yo soy argentino y me parece penoso que alguien tome esas actitudes. Y no soy un tipo exepcional que tengo los ojos sin vendas ni nada, soy un tipo normal con sentido comun. Como tambien me da pena que nos comparemos con otros y que siempre se llegue a la conclusion que el otro es mejor, como acabas de ejemplificar.

Lo que vos señalas como "la mayoria te aplaude" son grupidos de boludos, no representan a nadie ni influyen en nada. Lo de Japon no se realmente, no vivi en Japon, vos? Lo que si puedo decir con seguridad es que es logico pensar que va a haber mavivientes en todos lados, incluido Japon que se vanaglorean de sus no tan buenas intenciones. Repito, es una condicion humana, no es etnica, ni conoce de fronteras.

Lamento que estes tan desencantado con nosotros mismos, pero si queremos poner un granito de arena tenemos que no solo señalar nuestros errores sino proponer una solucion. Y la gente inteligente o mejor dicho con empatia social tiene aun mas responsabilidad para intentar generar esa mejora, porque son concientes de la realidad. Construir algo es complicadisimo, en cambio destruir algo lo haces en un minuto.

Quizas soy demasiado moralista o inocente, esperando que todos nos demos cuenta que nos necesitamos juntos y unidos. Suena un poco utopico, dada la historia que tenemos en los ultimos 200 años y mas.

[Chulk]

Quizas soy demasiado moralista o inocente, esperando que todos nos demos cuenta que nos necesitamos juntos y unidos. Suena un poco utopico, dada la historia que tenemos en los ultimos 200 años y mas.

Exacto, Alan. Utopico es la clave. Lamentablemente, la sociedad ha avanzado en una direccion en la que los piolas son cada vez mas y los que tenemos sentido comun y respeto por las normas (tanto legales como morales) somos cada vez menos.

[Duplode]

Eso nada mas, no digo que somos la peor mierda ni muchisimo menos. Pero lo que el argentino mismo define como "argentineadas" (esas cositas por fuera del sistema, con el unico fin de creerse mas vivo y piola que el resto) las odio.

Not really an argument, but I must confess Chulk's lament really stunned me, because 1) here in Brazil similar assessments are commonplace (replace "argentineadas" with "jeitinho brasileiro"); and 2) one positive stereotype about Argentinians here is that they stand comparatively better in terms of civic spirit and political involvement. I guess that fits Alan's words...

[alanrotoi]

Thanks! "Viveza criolla" is in every country. Finally!

[BonzaiJoe]

Same here. It's the coldest March in 26 years. Maybe it's coldest March in Europe ever?