ZakStunts 2004

[zaqrack]

Well altough 2003 season hasnt finished yet and there were some quiet months, I consider it very succesful. I enjoyed it much more than the 2002 season as a pipsqueak and a manager too.
I want to ask your opinion how should we continue.

1. Assistant Operator
I'd like to have an assistant who can help me maintaingin the site. This year the 2002 TDC winner Akoss Poo helped organizing the secondary competition, but only with designing tracks, nothing else. I'm not sure about having a secondary competition in 2004 (described later), but I'd like to have an assistant (mabye winner of TDC2003?) who can do the following things:

a. managing the secondary competition (if there's any)
b. write analysis, stats, reviews,news, etc.
c. update through phpmyadmin (easy job
d. if he knows php he can also write additional stats and tools for the site.

so this is based on further negotioations, if he doesnt want to see the replays, then he wont, only helps in other things.

2. Dual League
I think Dual League was a positive change. It'll stay unless you hate it so much you votre against it. However possibly the relegation/promotion system will change:

a. no separate pro league but a combined and an amateur (newbie). In this case we need a good system to decide who is already a pro. But this way newbies have their own goal.
b. separate leagues like this year but no relegation but only promotion according to strict rules.
c. same system as this year maybe with modified point system of course.

3. Secondary Competition
well this is an intresting topic. The secondary competition was meant to be providing more training for the newbies, but it didnt really turned out this way. Maybe it wasnt a good idea. Lets see some ideas:

a. no secondary competition/track at all
b. separate track for amateur/pro (only if leagues are separated) - sound like a bad idea anyway, maybe you like it.
c. one competition track for everyone, and one secondary for the amateur league only for extra points. Pros can join the track too but they dont earn points, only for fun. Works only if theres a separate league for amateurs.
d. same as above but the separate track is for the pros only.
e. secondary track for points for everyone. Of course only 10-20% wight compared to the main competition.

So this is a big question. Do we need a secondary competition, if we need for who, which rules, which cars, etc.

I'm open for any ideas...

[/b]

[JTK]

Hi Zak,

interesting questions... Well, I never entered the secondary competition and I'm not sure it is needed at all, but as I said I never entered it so I cannot decide. I do not need it.

I like the splitting of your competition. It offers more possibilities for weak pipsqueaks like me or fun pipsqueaks. I think you should keep those, also with the relegation rule (best ones from amateur move into pro and worst pro leave the league and return to amateur). Both leagues should race the same track each month.

What I still do not like, that's team racing. And there especially the big teams with many members. They are too dominant in the game, best pipsqueaks will gather in one team, others remain weak (like big, big MCLaren/Mercedes against small European/Minardi). Anyway, that is just my personal opinion...

I'm looking forward to season 2004!

CU, JTK

[al il professore]

i think the permanent competition must change in a way people really know it... you should put it under zct: act choice in the menu...

then i would not be the record man of the default track

[JTK]

And by the way, Zak - don't forget to put some retro tracks to the dual contest.

[BonzaiJoe]

You beat my record on Default?

[JTK]

Me?

[Mingva]

My vision of 2004 season:

1. Assistant Operator
a) every active pipsqueak can post one line in news section. E.g.,
28/10/2003 Mingva: yeah, try to beat my time. Alain: Oh my, Orion is the best Team! and etc.
b) I could do sometimes race reports if I won't continue IRC.

2. Dual League
No dual league. But...
a) point system 30-25-22-20-18-16-14-12-10-9-8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1. So, even 18 pipsqueaks would collect points!
b) only 10 or 11 best results counts. Or maybe for season result could be such formula:
season score = best result * 1.0 + 2nd best * 0.9 + 3rd best *0.8 + ... + 10th best *0.1
c) additional ranking: rookie/newbie - all pipsqueaks to whom season 2004 will be the first and in that year will race less than 2/3 (or 9, or whatever) of all races. In that way some newbs could have objectives and etc.
d) pro rankings - the best 10 pipsqueaks are consider as Pro. But this ranking wouldn't based on season result table. It would be like WRL: all points from last two races, plus 2/3 of last 3rd, plus 1/2 of last 4th and plus 1/3 of last 5th. And 10 pipsqueaks with most ranking points are Pro. After next race one pipsqueak can relegate from Pro because of weaker result (or better from amateur). Not racing will add -100 or -50 points. Almost will cause a relegation from Pro.
E.g., Mingva: z35 - 22p.; z36 - 16p.; z37 - 5p.; z38 - 20p.; z39 - 10p. In that case, my rank would be: 10+20+5*2/3+16*1/2+22*1/3=48.67. Let's say, on z40 I'm collecting 8. Then my rank would change to: 8+10+20*2/3+5*1/2+16*1/3=39.17.

3. Secondary Competition
Yes, secondary comp. is OK. But if you want to see many pipsqueaks, it should have value. Extra points for main comp. sounds well. The comp. could be based on retro tracks (maybe slightly modified), sometimes with special rules, or maybe for indy only.

[Akoss Poo a.k.a. Zorromeister]

Assistant: not me... I don't have time for it, maybe I can create some stats if you want, I like it.

Primary competition: I still vote on INDY and INDY each month (the big common league), and because of this, there's some need for Secondary Competition, where we can race the other cars.

Point system: I think 10-9-8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1 is the best. No average, no bigger gaps, NO surrendered track, all results must count.

Dual league: I hate it. There's no real value of being pro, since someone can win from amateur, too.

Retro tracks: no need, I don't want to drive again survived sections...

Teams: i agree with someone (I can't remember), I don't like such big teams. 3 or 4 drivers are enough per team.

I hate Mingva's weird opinions, ideas. Zak! Don't overcomplicate the system please once again.

If the secondary competition designer designs AMATEUR tracks, I will be very angry, because I wasn't allowed to do this this year (although the original price was that).

It is Orion's fault that Secondary Competition has no bigger value. Thanks to Alan Rotoi, Bonzai Joe (first to them), CTG, Usrin, Zak McKracken, this competition has come value (and thanks to anybody else who drove at least 1-2 tracks at least 90 percent hard).

[al il professore]

hi!

mingva, you must go on with irc next year... you are very good there, because with humility, you raised this competition to a classic, where it should have disappeared if you did not take it on... and i think your administration is a part of its success...

Akoss, i think you imply orion where i was the only pipsqueak that did clearly not chose to take part to an irrelevant competition with no competition for points at all... Orion team took part several times and encouraged it... My personal opinion is that ACT is not interesting.

So... let IRC on, let ACT on with points...

and let us play stunts!

[BonzaiJoe]

What do you mean you don't get points in the Secondary Competition? Sure you do... just like in any other competition.

My two cents:

Keep a simple point-system please
Keep the secondary competition please, and lots of INDY there please
Good idea to get rid of the separated pro-league and only have a separated amateur league.

[Argammon]

My opinion:

1)Reduce teams to 2 pipsqueaks per team!If a group of ppl still wants to stay together they can do OPPnear team A) and B) with independent points!

2)4 Retro tracks per 12 tracks!

3)BJ 'Good idea to get rid of the separated pro-league and only have a separated amateur league.' -agreed

4)Revamp the leading time system or get rid of it if no better option is available.
I remember I was punished for suggesting this 1,5 years ago but I will do it again *g*.
-Checkpoint at the middle of the month granting 3,2,1 bonus points.That way everyone will get an idea what to aim at at the end of the month and we will have some times on the scoreboards w/o having to fight second by second every day which I simply don't have the time for usually!

[al il professore]

The past proved its good to keep teams up to six members because the emulation within the team make times be better, and lots of selfish pipsqueaks from other teams want to be better than the big teams on their own talent.

Lets play on new tracks, retro tracks are worth a lap/year, not more... One track/year means 10% of the championship is played in the past?

the leading time is pure adrenaline...  

still waiting for a brilliant idea...

giving a newbie ten points in the final rankings if he competes three months = make them stay

nota: i censored my post cleaning it from all the trash... i wish i could be so calm all the time
nota: when i talk about a selfish pipsqueak, i did not accuse or want to hurt no one... except bonzai joe of course

[BonzaiJoe]

I think the leading time system as it is now is what makes the competition interesting and exciting at other times than at 21.00 on the deadline date.
I suggest team member limit be at 4, as 2 is no fun and 5-6 may make the team too dominant. I don't think this will be such a big problem for Orion, as Argammon is going to leave the team (now don't tell me you're not ), and Fernando Brito seems to be dead.

[alanrotoi]

...to get rid of the separated pro-league and only have a separated amateur league.

How it would be? Can you explain me?

[Mingva]

No more leading time bonus :!: