Car damage

[dreadnaut]

I'm laughing as I write this, but what if... every time you send a replay with a car you have already used, there is a chance for the car to break, and you can't use it anymore in the current race?

And what if that's the different between Amateur and Pro pipsqueaks? Amateurs, no damage. Pro, you push your car so much it can break!

[Overdrijf]

So... just wait for everyone else to do the exploration and send a single silent days replay?

[dreadnaut]

So... just wait for everyone else to do the exploration and send a single silent days replay?

I see what you did there, and raise you with 8 points of LTB.

[Overdrijf]

I see what you did there, and raise you with 8 points of LTB.

So, fun fact, of the two of us neither got any LTB last year. We seem to be in that spot where we're not amateurs yet not top contenders.

I think the idea is cool, but it would need something about it to be radically different. If a race runs for a month I would want people to be motivated to race and to post, not to postpone.

[Cas]

Uhm... I have the same feeling as Overdrijf. The idea really is very ingenious and makes the game more interesting, but tends to cause the opposite of what we want. There should be some mechanic to prevent this from happening.

I'm thinking also of the softer alternative in which the car has a chance to receive partial damage so its bonus percentage gets slightly worse for that pipsqueak, but still in my mind it looks like it would yield the same result.

Something different that could be interesting is, say you manage to get to the podium with a car that hasn't been used for any podium position on that race. Should that improve the bonus for that car for you on that single post?  It's difficult because any of these things are like adding ginger: you go past the point and it's too much

But again, the idea is really good. I hope it can be implemented in some way

[dreadnaut]

It's not an idea I was considering specifically for ZakStunts. I was thinking "how do we create uncertainty in a Stunts race?" and "how do we create a reason for not improving maniacally?"

What came to my mind was a "push your luck" mechanic, where you have to choose when to stop. If you never stop, you'll probably lose. You are gambling a better result against the chance that it will be your last result.

Delaying is a counter, yes. But can we counter-the-counter with increased incentives?

So, fun fact, of the two of us neither got any LTB last year. We seem to be in that spot where we're not amateurs yet not top contenders.

Confused about this answer, maybe I didn't explain properly. The "8 points of LTB" wasn't about real points, but about making it more interesting to improve your result in the face or a "car damage" mechanic. If you could be lucky and get 8 + 12, would that be enough to push someone to race through the month, instead of delaying?

[alanrotoi]

So... just wait for everyone else to do the exploration and send a single silent days replay?

I see what you did there, and raise you with 8 points of LTB.

Is it like Hogwarts?

I like the idea but not to be official

[Argammon]

It is just my opinion, but I do not like the idea at all and hope it is never implemented.

Do I like a mechanic that gives an incentive to stop improving manically? Yes

Do I like it to be luck based,NO!


If we really want to go that way, just limit the number of replays you are allowed to submit per car. Perhaps 5?
At least that would stop the 0.05 madness.  

[Duplode]

I find the idea very amusing, but I don't think it would work well at ZakStunts. Mainly, I feel we don't want to discourage exploratory laps, nor to make the race quieter. (That would be a concern both with the original proposal and with Argammon's alternative, as both aim at limiting replay submissions.)

[Daniel3D]

I don't think that adding 'luck' would work. It's to random..

[Overdrijf]

I'm actually opposed to this idea on a different ground. Adding luck to some aspect of the competition might work, but in roughly 90% of cases we want to encourage people to post a lot of replays. Someone posts laps with 8 different cars in the first two days? Super helpful. If they have to give up some of their precious replays they're not going to do that. Both versions of this idea in my opinion would mean encouraging only the very top pipsqueaks to engage in looking for the LTB with a few really strong replays and some strategic waiting for other people to post first, and everyone else should just save everything they have for the silent days, that's where you want to spend your replays.

Sharing your times is already punished enough by the existence of public days. But those serve a purpose, they make the track more fun for everybody because we're discovering things about it together. In my opinion we do not need to make sharing your times any less inviting without much reason.

If you guys really want the top dogs (anyone can try to do this, but after the third day or so it's automatically left to the faster drivers) to stop "LTB-blocking" everyone through time hiding and obsessively posting minor improvements everytime someone takes their top spot I would suggest finding a rule that specifically only stops that. Not one that discourages sharing times in general.

[dreadnaut]

If you guys really want the top dogs...

Nah, I was just making up a scenario, after recent discussions about scoring systems and addiction.

Very interesting to see the different takes on randomness — which pervades real-life racing but we are mostly free from in Stunts.

[alanrotoi]

It could work in a special event. It's like somebody said, the events and competitions are the real game.

[dreadnaut]

Yes, could be an interesting experiment.

I think there could be something interesting in adding a scarce resource. In ZakStunts and most competitions, the limited resource is *time to play*. A very short race (e.g., a live race), makes that a fix amount for everyone, and uses "attention and skill".

Maybe something odd where the fastest replay with the slowest car wins could be an interesting one too 🤔

[Overdrijf]

Maybe something odd where the fastest replay with the slowest car wins could be an interesting one too 🤔

So... that's just an LM002 race? Or were you thinking more some kind of a system with say coefficients for cars so they're all on a level playing field?